TO THE WOLF PACK - PLEASE READ.

Ok, so this has been bugging me for some time and I need to get it off my chest. This post is mainly for the WOLF PACK but anyone else that chooses to post an opinion is very welcome to do so.
All I ask is that you listen to what I have to say and give me your opinions after. Right, so I'll begin ...

My Mother is a Nurse and up until a few months ago she was working in the childrens ward in our local hospital. She told me about a 15 year old girl that had been admitted because of bad self-harming and trying to end her life. This girl self-harmed every imaginable way possible, I'm not going to tell you how because I don't want people to get any ideas.
The reason she self-harmed was because she was being sexually abused by her step-father, her Mother sadly knew but she just shut her eyes to it, blocked it out. She blamed the Girl for it, apparently it was ''her fault'.

Can you imagine what that girl must have been going through?

My Mother told me that underneath all her black clothes and long black hair, she was such a beautiful girl but she was so sad and lonely inside.
Would you blame this girl for self-harming? Would you call her weak and pathetic as you do to so many people on this site?

Part of me agrees with your bashing, cause yes it can help as I've seen. But what if a girl like her came on here, a girl that was being abused and hurt. Could you honestly say that bashing her would help? I'm sure deep down it would make things so much worse.
That Girl that my Mother saw in hospital was weak, no doubt about it. But she had a good reason.

I believe that the people you Wolf Pack have helped are strong inside, It takes me alot of courage to say this but I think that the only reason I self-harmed was because it was the easy way out. I didn't have to talk about my problems, face my fears. I could just hurt myself more and other people in the process.

Basically what I'm trying to say is calling people weak and pathetic sometimes doesn't help. I think what you should do is research into self-harm, find out a little more about it, why people do it, what they feel. Get some knowledge for it before you diss people when you really .... don't understand.

My Mother told me that before she started working as a Nurse she didn't understand my self-harm, she thought it was stupid like many of you do. But then when she met that girl and many others like her, she began to understand. She could see what you can't see, not a weak, stupid little girl ... but a scared, insecure person that needed a friend.

Phew, I think I'm almost done. I'd really love to hear your opinions on this ..
I'm not trying to cause an argument, and I don't want to be bashed. I'm just honestly trying to get a better understanding of this.

Thanks for reading if you got this far!
Take care.

"I think what you should do is research into self-harm, find out a little more about it, why people do it, what they feel."

well, I am not part of the wolf pack but I agree with their ideas. about the above quote, I don't think I have to research that, I've been through it, and from what I've read a lot of the wolf pack have too.

The little girl you made an example of didn't know any better. If someone were to show her that it makes you weak, (which it does), she would atleast have that knowledge. It's up to her wether she chooses to accept it and use it.

As for people calling cutters pathetic, yes it can get a little harsh. what I think would work is if we tried suttle movements and when it doesnt get through their thick heads, thats when you become harsh.

just my opinions.

I'm not part of the wolf pack either, but I'm putting my opinions in too.

I realised on my own accord how stupid my self harm was, and how much it was hurting people other than myself. Yes, I know what it's like to be weak, but if someone showed that girl the other ways out, I'm sure she would realise that hurting herself more than her stepfather already is, is not the way out.

I agree with Renee on many accounts. It does get a tad harsh, and yeah I don't think people have to research on self harming. There's no way to find out how someone truly feels, because someone who selfharms never really has the strength to tell someone how they really, truly feel.

Well, there it is. That's what I think to all this. Not starting an argument, just stating my opinions.

You can never have to much knowledge about self-harm I think. I'm studying Mental Health at University and even thought I'm a recovering self-harmer, some of the stuff I read I never knew before.

It just gives me a better understanding of it and even thought I may never fully realize what goes on in any one persons head, I can try to help.

well, that is a good point since other people may have different motives and feelings toward their self harm.

A lot of the wolf pack has done A LOT of research on self-harm and continues to do so....And yes, some are past self-harmers. I'm not necessarly a part of the pack, but I'm really close to it...I'm not a part of it because I don't want to be one who says some of the really offensive things.

The pack does take it out of hand sometimes, and I don't mean to look like I'm turning against the pack, because I'm not, a lot of what they say now is the same things that helped me.

I agree with what Kim and Renee say about the little girl situation. I think what happened what she had no one to help her through and to care about her enough to stop her, to save her...maybe if she had the wolf pack around that would have helped her...parts of it, the parts that show how kind they are...by telling her that SELF-HARMING (not her) is pathetic and not a good thing to do...now, I've been on her side of the fence as well...I'm a recovering self-harmer, and still sometimes wish I was one, but I know that I can be strong, and I know the wolf pack is right.

I think that's all....

Yeah I know Nada's done her research but as for the others I didn't know that.

If they've researched it and STILL think it's stupid then that's fair enough, but the point I was trying to make was that if you don't research it and call people names it's totally unfair cause you don't understand.

That's cool that they've looked it up though.

I'm almost sure Natalie and Ismail have...They may not of, but I believe I recall them saying they did...and I think Brittney may of. And I'm acheing to start soon. I have school tomorrow and I'm going to go to my Guidance counselor at my lunch or sometime and get a shit load of information on anything I can (eg. Self-harm, sexual orientation, drugs/alcohol...) Just so I can do some research....and then there's always the good internet *pats computer*

I'm pretty sure they have done stuff. Certainly Nada has...She's away though. =( E>

I do understand your points though Crimson, it takes time to look past their hard surfaces, but inside they're mushy like peaches...just read some of their poems...they are normal people with feelings to...

That's great Mortie. I totally respect the people that take the time out to go and get information about self-harm.

I totally learned something new today though ... Looking in a website. Apparently anorexia and bulimia are forms of self-harm. I didn't know that and it really surprised me.

I'm sure they all are great people though, it's just sometimes I don't agree with what they're saying. But not everyone will. I know they've helped lots of people and that is so cool. I think it's really brilliant actually.

If you think about it, anything can be self-harm...Smoking ciggarettes is self-harm, you're killing yourself with the nicotene (sp?), drinking alcohol is self-harm, you're killing your liver, drugs is killing your brain, anorexia is well, it's starving yourself to death, bulimia is also starving yourself in a sense that you throw up what you eat...

And even things like skateboarding...you put yourself at risk, right? you can easily get killed. I don't know, that's how I've seen it since that's how one of my friends dealed with his problems, instead of cutting or something he would go skateboarding, and since he'd be upset he'd be more wreckless and could hurt himself much easier.
I hope that makes sense?

Even I don't agree with what they say sometimes...but we can't stop what they say alot of the time, all I can say is their words can help, but sometimes for some people it makes them worse, untill they realize behind their words, it will hurt...but hopefully they see.

wow mortie, I never saw it like that.

But, with cutting/burning you do it in order to feel pain and to hurt yourself. when you go skateboarding you don't deliberately hurt yourself. same goes with drugs, ciggies, and alcohol. people take these substances to make them feel better or numb. they also don't leave scars on your body.

But they do kill you just as quickly...I think with the alcohol/ciggies/drugs it is an escape yes, but it can kill you just as quick as cutting....with cutting, yes there are scars, and it also drains blood which eventually does something to your heart, I can't remember what Natalie said, something like that though.
It's not a deliberate self-attack, no...but it is self-harm none the less...

Hmmm, that's a good point Mortie.

Renee from what I've learnt people cut in order to feel in control, they have no control over other things in their life so they turn to cutting and burning. It's totally the wrong thing to do but I guess self-harmers don't see it that way.

You're right Crimson, that is how it feels...most of the time, but in the end they realize self-harm has taken control of THEM....making it ahrder to quit...but if we can prevent it before it gets that bad..then score...mission accomplished....

It is wrong to handle things like that, but they know no better, that's what the pack is trying to tell them. People just need to see that...

Exactly, self-harm controls them. I totally agree.

See, If the wolf pack talked to people like you are talking to me now, very civilised and informative. Don't you think more people would listen?

Certainly, and they can talk like this, but look at it from their view now, the way that the anti-wolf pack people treat them. They aren't nice, so the pack isn't nice back. Make sense?...

On a random note for the wolf pack - DOROTEA COMES BACK TODAY =D

Yeah, I suppose. Damn, I hate it when I'm wrong!

Lol, but I still would love to hear other peoples opinions on this subject. Especially Natalie's.

Lol =D

Come on people, I want your opinions ...

Erm, I'm not sure if I agree.

See I don't think self-harming has anything to do with being strong or weak. Like I said before it's control, self-harmers like to feel in control and alot of them think that's the only way they can be.

I suppose In a way they are strong, like you said, for doing it. But then again they could be weak for resorting to something like that.

I just don't know ...

Well I agree with Crimson tears sometimes there's a time for bashing, and a time for not bashing sometimes bashing can push the person over the edge, and sometimes it can help the person get better you just gotta know when to bash, and when not to bash.

Just want to know Ismail, do you have any experience in self-harm? Research, recovering self-harmer?

I'm curious.

Wow, That must have been hard. I wasn't trying to be horrible I was just asking an honest question.

I've had alot of people call me stupid for self-harming and I've found that they have had no experience with it, havn't got a clue what it's about. I think it's wrong to call self-harm pathetic if you don't actually know what you're talking about and that's what pisses me off.

You obviously do, and I apologise if I offended you in any way.

I agree with crimson. The wolf pack can help some people, but I reckon they must be the strong ones. If someone comes on here and wants to talk about cutting/ self harm etc and they get bashed for it then it might just push them over the edge.

Thank you Rachel. I appreciate your comment :D

My pleasure :) Its a good post you've started.

"If a faceless internet bout, pushes them over the edge,then they seriously need help."

Yeah thats what Im saying, the ones that seriously need some help might get pushed over the edge by someone bashing them. I also said that the wolf pack have helped some people but they are the strong ones. Really weak people might not be able to put up with people insulting them even if its just on the internet.

*Sigh*

I don't know, I don't think anyone's ever going to agree on this subject.

The truth of the matter is, bashing someone highly insecure and emotional COULD push them over the edge. Yeah they may need help, but how can you say that Ismail when they actually come on these message boards TO ask for help.

You may think your insults are not personal but as you can probably see alot of people take them to heart. Especially if they're down and hurting already.

At last! Someone who talks some sense on this site! I love you crimson :P

Ismail: Exactly, we dont know who is weak, so wouldnt it be better to stop bashing everyone in the first place? Im gonna be in trouble for saying that, I know its never going to happen lol.

(haven't read the posts above)

No, I would definitly not call her weak and pathetic because she cuts. If her reasons for cutting are understandable (which they are), then I'd help her to move on in life and get over the hurt and the pain. Not all cutters, definitly not all, are pathetic.

But yes there are so many of those who are. This site is full of them. Bashing really helps with them because most of them don't cut seriously and just want to boast about it. They are the ones who need to realize the stupidity of it.

Rachel,

No. We can't stop 'bashing.' And, may I add, it's not bashing either. We're forcing them to realize, with our harsh words, that cutting is useless. A lot of people need to have something shouted at them for them to understand. That goes for the 'cutters' too.

True Dorotea, so true.

Thanks Rach :D

Yep, I totally agree. That classifys as attention seeking and I just can't be bothered with all that.

But, some people on here do genuinly ask for help and yet you, (not you personally) still bash them. That is something I cannot understand.

Please don't get all defensive with me Ismail, I'm merely trying to have an adult conversation with you.

*sighs* I cant say anything right can I? :P

Dorotea:

1. I know its not bashing, its just what everyone else calls it and I wanted to fit in :)
2. I know the wolf pack help people but harsh words arent the answer in all cases.

Well I think it's bashing, in some cases bullying.

Natalie has told people in the past to go and ''slice and dice'' themselves because they're ''retards''

And you say that's not bashing Dorotea?

And ismail: Yeah i hate posts with titles such as: 'songs to cut to' or 'what so you use to cut with' They are totally pathetic and the people who start them arent helping anybody.

Yeah, it's not the answer to every case, but on this site it is for most cases.

It sounded like you were.

Yeah, I totally agree. Nada helped me to see that cutting was not the answer. But the way it was said was so different. She talked to me, explained. She didn't bash me and make me feel stupid.

Dorotea: Ahh but im still trying to get the message across that in the very few cases that it doesnt help, it could turn out to be a very bad thing.

And if anyone dares say Im trying to go against the wolf pack that isnt true. I dont know if they realise it but they stopped me from cutting, and thats just by reading what they said to other people. I guess I felt a bit too intimidated to ask personally for some help in case people thought bad things about me but they made some good points in other posts which helped alot. The only person out of the entire wolf pack who doesnt seem to help is natalie, but hey theres always gonna be someone you dont like isnt there? :)

True Rachel. I think Natalie sometimes goes a little to far.

Alot of the opinions expressed by them are true, as much as it hurts to admit it. But when it gets to bullying and just being plain mean, then there's something wrong.