Opinion on Gay marriage

italianxxHeartache:
"yet you are pretty much going against what God's word says"

I Just Said Specificly In Every Post "I Don't Approve Of The Gay Lifestyle"...Duh I Don't Agree Because I'm Christian...But I Don't See The Point In Gays Being Held Back From Marriage Because It Isn't Marriage Thats So Wrong In Gods Eyes Its The Fact That Their Gay....lol So I Don't Really Care What Gay People Do In My Opinion....Marriage Makes No Diffrence Whether Its Legalized Or Not Because Gays Will Always Live Together And Act As If They Are Married Anyway...Theirs Nothing Me As a Christian Can Do To Change That And I Wouldn't Try, All I Can Do Is Pray For Them, ...Thats Not Being Hyprocital Thats Just Being Real, Pluss In Texas If Two Gay People Live Together For a Certain Amount Of Years Their Pronounced "Legaly Married" Even If They've Never Got Hitched... xoxo-Nikki-xoxo

It's not hurting YOU. It's their life, therefore they shouldn't be forbidden to do something harmless to the rest of society. It's pretty selfish and ridiculous to disagree. & I'm a bit late on this thread.x

At the end of the day it comes down to what we would call a victimless crime.

Homosexuality was a crime, but hurt no-one. It was a crime of moral interpretation.

Now homosexuality is legal and therefore morally acceptable in the eyes of the law.

This is now a matter of law, not moral interpretation and therefore falls under the subheading civil rights which also has nothing to do with religion.

Therefore all religious arguments on the subject are null and void.

(also I'm still waiting for a reply arguing for gay marriage in the eyes of the church [read my last post])

OK i see where you are coming from. but God is everywhere. Everything on the other hand ...he isnt Gay. Tell me where it says God is gay and i will belive you. but i never recall after going to church since i was little ever hearing God is also gay. And to tell you the truth i dont have all these answers. But do i really have to? what made you belive that God could possibly be gay? i mean i have never heard it...but where on earth did you hear it?? see you are asking me to answer all this. and expect me to find you a perfect answer? wel im not God so that isnt possible. but obviously i have my own views of this and you have yours. i really dont need to write what i belive if i know it wont make any difference. but you can belive what you want and i respect that, but i would rather not just keep telling you that i do get what i belive from this FROM God. and when you ask me to give you answers without using what you cal "garbage"...i cant because that "garbage" is what i or my family lives by. or atleast try to live by. So whatever ..

You know what. I am so sick of debating this crap. If you really believe that the Bible, a book written by politically inspired men of power should be used to influence in any way, the laws of the land and your opinions on the moral character of any human being, be they Gay or otherwise, then there is nothing I am interested in saying to you that you would understand, which is a great sadness to me.

Love is not the law with you, and to be honest, the God I know would be ashamed of you all.

ok when i said "tell me where is says God is gay and i will belive you"

i mean..Bible wise. Everything about God is in the bible. so if It said God was also gay in the bible..then i would believe it. Because the bible [[in my eyes]] is all truth. reguardless of what any of you say i know what i believe. so therefore if you cant prove it then i wont belvie it. And if for some reason you thought he was gay...then i respect that...but dont try and shove stuff in my face telling me to give you all these answers to everything. I dont want to argue with anyone just saying what i think about the topic..so sorry if i 'offended' or made any of you ticked.....

It may talk about that. but it does say that man and man , woman and woman, is an abomination. So why would God be of something he isnt for. Hmmmmm. well and yea what do you think the 'devil' is for? obviously bad. And he is a blame. And God did create Satan. He was Gods angel then Satan left God and went to evil. Once again that "choice" comes in. He chose to leave God. God doesnt control the choices we make he let's us make them whether they are good or bad. ofcourse he wants us to chooses the better ones and thats why there is the bible to help us understand more...

Well Glass, I guess you thought I was right if you didn't answer my debate.

Okay, what is Gay Marriage going to do? Absolutely nothing. It is a vow that two people make in love. It is the same as Straight Marriage. It isn't harming anyone in the process, I don't see anything wrong with it. It is their life, why can't anyone let them live it? Seriously.

You might believe through God, but what is wrong with it? The fact that two people of the same sex is together? It isn't harming anyone. So I don't get your views. Just because in the Bible it says something, you are going to believe it yourself? If you think about it, you are defending nothing.

The reason why there are more Gays today is because more and more are coming out. They have been here since the beginning of time. Before the Bible it was unquestionable that being with someone of the same sex wasn't 'normal', for we had no knowledge of this act, so nobody came out with it. Now, there are so many people opening up, and now people are feeling comfortable saying they are.

What if just because you were Christian you weren't able to marry? It is you beliefs, isn't it? So you would fight for them? So these Gays believe this is the way they are, and that they want to marry their love... you can't stop them, that is the way the FEEL.

ok being gay isnt a religion. christianity is. if christians wouldnt beable to marry either would catholic jewish and a whole bunch more. Thats a whole different thing you are talking about.

I am 110% FOR Gay Marriage. I don't understand why some people must make a big deal out of the fact that two people of the same gender wanna get married. I think that two people of the opposite gender should have the same rights as two people of the same gender. It's about love. If you love them, you should be able to show it.

Ok i totally respect that. im not trying to make a big deal. and i understand what you mean. but thats your opinion. its more then just people loving eachother. But im just letting you know that im not an idiot. i get what you are trying to say...

ok "dwelt".
you know whats really annoying...
people who come here acting like they know
everything. everything about people and the bible.
cuz im so sure you do right?
whatever this conversation is dumb and sitting here reading what you just wrote it a waste of time.
but you dont know me at all so you cant sit here and tell me what I know and what i DONT know and what i need to do. so get a life please.

If We Have Any Luck a Mod Will Lock This Post Because Its Getting Out Of Hand...Seriously...xoxo-Nikki-xoxo

yea...i agree with you....hopefully they will

lol But I Must Admit The Poets On This Site Give Great Arguments *Thumbs Up* xoxo-Nikki-xoxo

lol. i guess thats pretty true ;]

I'm not sure why this should be locked, unless of course people feel they are being attacked?

Serious debate requires we put our characters on the line to back up our words, because if you are being honest, you are your words. So it should come as no surprise that at some point, people will feel like they are being attacked because their beliefs are.

I'm not going to lock this, though it is getting rather long for loading purposes. Start another one if you wish...I think this is getting interesting...things are starting to repeat and become clear....old arguments are losing their power...simple truths come though... bit like humanistic counselling.

Sorry Kev, couldn't be arsed to restart the thread, mate.

Repost of my question to glass and italian:

If gays had the rights to marriage that would promote monogamy in the gay community* and therefore slow the spread of HIV. Wouldn't this ideal alone encourage the right to gay marriage? Thoughts?

HIV in America: http://www.avert.org/statsum.htm

It is thought that 60% of infected Americans are young gay men. The majority, yes, but not overwhelmingly so. This number is in the decline and HIV in women has incread by about 25% in the last 5 years of which hispanic and black women take the vast majority at 80% of this amount.*

* All statistics are estimated because according to the site actual numbers are not fully known.

Yes that's my only type of reason.
No that's not my only type of reason.

Is what I was kinda looking for.

Sometimes gay marriage is okay and other times i think that its wrong. But then again if your truely in love with the same sex i think that u should do what u feel.

Well to "dwelt" ...
Thats the thing. maybe i am not a wiz on the bible.
but i have been going to church since i was 5.
i sit there in a service 3 times a week. so please dont tell me i dont have any knowledge. They have preached about Gay marriages. So im not an idiot just sitting here giving you false crap. And tahts the thing just because i am a Christian. if i say one thing wrong. people like you hold it against me like im a murderer or something. So what im not perfect and neither are any christians. I respect what your opinion is on the whole HIV thing. but that isnt even what this is about. actually just reading that gave me a headache...

The thing, Italian, is that your point of view lacks back-up information.

Like what is exactly wrong with Gay Marriage? That it is just against the Bible?

Well you know what, do you believe other Religions? Such as Buddhism, Muslimism, or Hinduism? Right, you don't, because you believe in Christianity. But Gay People sometimes don't believe in God. You are trying to put them under a law that doesn't go WITH THEIR beliefs, but AGAINST them. Your putting them under a law that is YOUR BELIEFS and not THEIRS. So what if you were put under a law that says you couldn't pray? Or couldn't go to church?

Do you see what I mean? We can't put a whole nation under a law that doesn't go with everyone's beleifs. It isn't fair.

^We can't put a whole nation under a law that doesn't go with everyone's beleifs. It isn't fair.

Memoirs, Italian doesn't need any other back up. it's a faith based system of belief and does not require back up.

The sooner you understand AND accept that the sooner you will be able to accept Italian's point of view for what it is.

This is the best and worst thing about the democratic process. Everyone gets a say in the matter and nothing anyone believes or how the decide to vote requires 'back up'.

I love being able to say I don't believe something should be allowed just because that's what I think and I'll defend everyone elses right to do the same whether I agree with it or not.

Also there are plently of laws in use today that people do not agree with. These are laws that deal with what a person does to themselves.

An example of this is seatbelts.

It is common sense to wear a seat belt, it can save your life in the event of a crash, but just because it helps doesn't mean it should be mandated.

I made a point earlier that Gay marriage will be a law that will not anyone other than gay people and will not affect anyone else other than the two consenting adults who choose to marry in any fashion unless they go out of their way to interfere with it.

Therefore gay marriage should be lawful.

Memoirs:
OK i understand what you mean.
and i know that it has a lot to do with all the different belifes. and i get that people shouldnt be forced to do something they dont want to. And actually There are places where people who are christians arent allowed to pray and arent allowed to have a church service. But i dont have to have back-up reasons. Because yea its based on faith and im not saying that gay people are bad people . they are humans just like everyone else. And to them it feels right because there are a lot of other people out there doing the same thing. But just because there are more and more people doing it, does that make it right? And for some, maybe they dont know because it was just a lifestyle and were never taught anything different. But then maybe they were and they just didnt care. As in christians eyes, being gay is wrong because we love God and live by the bible, and man being with man and woman being with woman isnt what we live by. It may not really make sence to people who are for gay marriage, but to us it does. I have no proble with the *person* that is gay. I just dont like what they are doing. And to tell you the truth it is kinda a situation that is uncomfortable for me. Like on movies when there is a gay guy who is all girly , yea its funny and cute. But thats not the point.but im not sitting here trying to diss people that are for it and are gay, but im getting my veiws out there, and a lot of people really dont like christians because they are really religeous and hate people that sin. which is totally NOT true. i am not religeous, if i was religeous i wouldnt have friends that are not christian, i dont judge them for who they are, i love them just the way they are. they arent perfect so why expect people to know and belive everything you do right? thats my point.
does that make any sence to you..or am i just wasting my time???
:/

Italian- Okay, I’m sorry. Your beliefs are your beliefs that should be reasonable back up. I understand your point of view, because I use to be Christian. I’m not gay, I’m Atheist, but I understand where you are coming from. You aren’t wasting your time, just sometimes I get all up into the moment in get very angry. But the thing is I really don’t think Religion and Government should mix. This is exactly what is happening now with Gay Marriage. I see that you have your views, and in your beliefs it is wrong for man and man to be together, but I think Marriage is something that is not involved with that. No offense, but I don’t think Christians/Catholics should be interfering with this road that Gays choose to follow. I’m Atheist, and my views on certain things such as where I come from are the opposite of yours, but its not like I’m going out in the world and trying to convert you to Atheism because that is your Religion, I’m not going to stop you from practicing it or believing in it. So why should you, and as in ‘you’ I mean Christians/Catholics, try to interfere with a Gay’s relationship? It’s their choice. If they want to get married, they can, in their belief system it is okay. How I view it, everyone has a little bubble surrounding them that bubble being their beliefs. Nobody has the right to invade that bubble. How would you feel if someone made laws against your beliefs? Do you see what I’m saying? I just think Religion has no right to be constituted into laws. Your beliefs are your beliefs, Gays beliefs are their beliefs, it should be left at that.

I think we should take religion out of this debate, because I'll be honest with you all, every post I've seen from a pro christian anti gay marriage viewpoint frustrates and saddens me.

We are not talking about religion here, we are supposed talking about laws and civil liberties, there is a reason Church and state should be seperated, in goverment and in this discussion.

That way, when we discuss this issue, we talk about the issue on it's merits based on logic, reason and nothing more...no Gods, books etc etc.

ok am gonna try and cover a lot of what has been commented on.. as briefly as I can..
1) I am les, live in the UK where gay marriages are legal and will be getting married to my partner!
2) as far as i remember adam and eve were created, and although man and woman they had kids and the population grew from there.. i believe incest is more disgusting than gay marriages by a long shot!
3)There is no way in the world you can compare gay/les/bi's to paedohiles!! using young children for sex is wrong!simple!
4) the main reason for not wanting to people of the same sex to be together, is because god created men and women to reproduce (apparently).. i am les, but was married and have 3 children who are happy with who i am, so have done my part for population.. and even if i didnt have children, believe there are enough straight people in the world to keep the population going.. until we all kill each other through war anyway!
5) what exactly will we be taking from straight people by getting married? whether we can get married or not, we will still be gay.. so makes no difference to YOU!
6) i have really enjoyed this discussion
7) as long as you are not hurting nebody else, i believe everybody should be able to live their lives and marry whoever they truely love and want to spend the rest of their life with
and last but nowhere near least
7) Billie? (my girlfriend) WILL YOU MARRY ME? i love you with all my heart and soul xxxx

btw no.2 was not to get at christians, it was just to get the point across, how can they judge gay/les and say that it is wrong when they dont believe sex between brothers and sisters, fathers and daughters, mothers and sons (which ever way it worked) to be wrong

all very well pointed there! Think you hit it all on the nail ;)

as for the question...YES...baby you know I will marry you :) It is just a matter of time is all ;)

*doh forgot to say.....
I love you to with all my heart and soul!

....now what is wrong with this.... if you did not know we were female/female everyone would think it was sweet and great but once the gender is known makes it different...why??? shouldn't be any different :)

thanks Kristen :)

yeah thanks kirsten ;) xx

I'm happy for anyone who's in love. As long as it is genuine love and not any of that fake love that people use as an excuse to have a physical relationship.

I think that ALL love is sweet and great. (well, as long as it doesn't involve a human and any barnyard or exotic animals. lol.)

lmao....barnyard animals....that is funny ....lmao
moooo baby moooo ...pmsl hehehehe

*doh.. pmsl.. see where the crazy part comes in ya name baby .. i agree all love is great ;)

Only barnyard and exotic animals? what about rabbits, hamsters (take note Richard Gere), Guinea pigs goldfish etc?

*grins*

... i... think...im...afraid...barnyard animals? how did they come into play?

you know what ive always wondered though, are some animals gay, les, bi?

I think my pup is les lol she is always trying to hump my female cat *doh think she may be confused tho.. her mum lives with my 2 les friends and her dad lives with 2 other les friends and then she moved in with me and i am les lol

A goldfish...man you'd need a huge bowl, lmao!!!

Ok donna. just to let you know. i DID say that i am a christian and i DONT judge gay people.! Its what i belive, i dont hate the person, i just belive what they are doing isnt right. Im not saying that a gay person is a bad person. do i really have to repeat myself?? oh and just to let you know, i never recall anybody that i know that is christian saying sex between family isnt wrong. because it is. where did you even get that. i think you should check your facts.