On a religious note.....(Lets hope i don't regret this)

I spent about 30 minutes writing a post and when I hit post it deleted......maybe it was an intervention (spooky) anyways, I will condense because frankly im loosing the will to live lol.

I wrote a poem called "Religious Fools" which made front page this week, I am both humbled and surprised by this and wanted to say why I wrote this piece, it wasn't to offend or get a rise out of people it was for this reason.

I am an atheist and I am tired of seeing how the religious all over the world are treating each other. All in the name of God.

You only have to look in the newspapers, turn your TV on or look on Facebook and other social media at how the parties of god treat each other within their own religions and others and even to those who have no religion as such.

Now I want to make this perfectly clear. I have friends who are Jewish, Christian and Muslim, and I do not believe that all religious people are bad, many are kind, gentle, respectful and see everyone as their brother or sister. What people believe is ENTIRELY their own business and i genuinely do not begrudge them that which gives their life hope and meaning and love so long as A) they don't try to force their beliefs on others and B) they do not use this as a justification to harm other people.

However....I do mind very much being told that I am a bad person or soulless for not believing it too, or that my son will burn for eternity if he is not baptised (Catholic church has done a turnaround on this in recent years) I mind when people think they have the right to do what they want. I mind very much this being taught to my son in school as if it was truth, something that is Fact. There is a reason it is called FAITH and BELIEF.

I mind when the religious think they have more morals than I, that because they believe what they do they have some kind of superiority of the rest of us when in both the Christian and Islamic faiths they cannot even agree which version is the right one (Catholic vs Protestant vs Mormon etc or Sunni vs Shia etc)

It has been said that good people will do good things and evil people will do wicked things but if you need a good person to do evil things then you'll need religion. This may seem like an almost flippant or throw away comment, however, it actually articulates Devine Command Theory perfectly.

Under Devine Command Theory in the mind of a believer violence, depravity, actions and deeds which no rational person would dream of enacting are immediately justified and in many cases are fuelled with the promise of an eternity in paradise or heaven. There is no act, however repugnant or wrong that cannot be justified under DCT, that in fact it is considered a duty to carry out said duty.

The Somarra dome is a perfect example, one of the most beautiful buildings ever to be built, a place of worship in the Islamic community reduced to rubble by religious bigots who were offended (even though both sides preach from the Quran).

Religion IS the reason for the heart ache and murder of the world right now, currently it's biggest threat comes from those who claim to know the mind and wish of Allah, 40 years ago it was the Christians, just look back all through out history and you will find various different religions there telling the world how they should live.

Anyways, thank you for reading, big loves.

I would also like to add that if anything above offends or you require clarification on what I mean I am happy to clarify that.

Known fact, religion has been more responsible for hate crimes and senseless killing than anything known to man, people embrace it for its love, but then hate those who don't....so much hypocrisy......it's a new day, you can basically write about anything, a few years ago, you would have been blasted....people are too busy looking for pokemon....lmao

Lol, I know how some religious folk take things sometimes, I just wanted to make clear that i wasn't writing something just to cause a stir or be offensive and I don't lump all religious people into the same box.

I know what you mean though, you would think that having God in their lives would make them happy, make them chill but unfortunately many can't seem to get to that point until everyone else believes it too. for some it is completely poisonous.

So true; Nice post Ben, I think everyone or the majority, are losing the will to live.

You already know my background, so no need to bring it up, since we have been on good terms and know enough about each other, to a certain extent.

Personally I do not really believe that religion can make you a better person or a good person, religion itself, despite which one, is just a package of morals from one side, and a package of very vague and tricky teachings from another side; the dangerous side.

The moral part anyway is not restricted to religion, for instance having ethics has nothing to do with what you believe in...you cannot believe that murder is a good deed, whether you believe in God, in Jesus, in prophets, in Buddah, in nothingness, in whatever holly authority one tends to believe in, or not.

Ethics in natural cases is innate and comes with people who are sane inevitably, to respect to love to help someone in need, you don't really need to have religion to do that.

I deeply believe that the biggest threat on everyone is not the word "religion" itself, it's the practicing, it's the scholars, the danger lies in the places they call "the house of God" be it temples, churches, mosques, etc. 90 % of religious scholars are retards who deeply know that most of the Do and Don'ts which they tell people about, most of the things they call "Sins", are 90% wrapped up with alleges to keep their own communities and followers in one circle...Psychological games if you want.

Starting from marriage, Islam or Christianity and most other religions, most of their do and don'ts and so called sins are made up teachings to put pressure on people to do as they are told and to try keep them from going astray, otherwise do you really believe that someone who you believe is so big and holly as God, for example, is going to punish you for deciding to spend your life with someone with different beliefs, or for having an inmate relationship with someone you deeply love without uttering the words "I do" under the supervision of religious scholar ? No, it's just for the sake of having witnesses on your commitment, to keep one's rights safe perhaps, since it's really just a couple of words that one might not be very honest when uttering, so thus it becomes useless. If you know what I mean.

What I'm trying to say, I am a believer, but it's what I believe in that matters, I was given a mind to use, to think, to explore, to read and take what convinces me into account and to question what doesn't make sense. One cannot be blind, that is the utmost sin in my opinion. You simply cannot harm anyone in the name of religion, it just contradicts your whole concept, it's hypocritical!

Everyone is getting sick with religious thoughts, there is nothing offending about you getting sick about it, whoever rejects your emotions is someone who's defending what they believe is their safe-haven. We are all in danger, we are all a target, we all need to be wiser.

Personally, I live my life according to what makes me feel comfortable, I do believe in God, I practice whatever I believe in and it's personal, has nothing to do with others, and most importantly my believe in God that has nothing to do with my disbelief in many teachings, and in me strongly doubting the sacredness of 90% of the teachings spread by Scholars whether Islamic or Christian or Jewish. Every single religion has its own package off bull**** that piled up with time on the hands of those who pretend to know and those who consider religion as a very successful "business".

ALL religious scholars and ALL religious teachings that intervene deep between people and that condemns co-existence indirectly and directly are made up teachings with very sick background and need to cleansed off, but it's too late I guess.

Few years back, I would have defended the concept of religion, however today I have a firm belief that religion is your kind relationship with your surrounding, and the bond you have with the one you believe has given this life for you, and this bond better be kept in your heart rather than enforced on others.

Nicely put Nana :)

As most of you know, I work with folks who have been homeless, drug addiction and mental illness.

One of the worse cases I have ever seen is a man who was an accountant in New York City. He was a strong believer of Catholic faith. The onset of schizophrenia set in....his priest convinced him that he was possessed by demons and that he was un-clean.

Instead of going to a Dr, he began to self harm and mutilate himself, he became violently aggressive, kicked out of the church and later became homeless. Even though he had a bank account bigger than most. He felt he was an outcast.

This man is now in our program, taking medication, intense therapy, and soon will be moving into his own apartment.

But he is fearful of any religious based teachings and one of his goals is to start a support group for people who have been misguided....

I am Wiccan, I have dear friends, who are of all faiths and it's a beautiful thing....the program I work for is Christian based, but if the resident or staff member chooses not to participate in Christian teachings or events, they don't have to.

It took staff 3 months to earn his trust, and help him understand that no other religion would be part of his treatment. He won't even walk near the chapel.

I've had numerous conversations with my friends about how our beliefs are different and yet we all are open to embracing others no matter what they believe.

Fact remains, when a person is judged, or made to feel less than ....under the name of religion you are going to have devastation.

This has been going on for thousands of years and it's only getting worse.

Straight up Sister!

No offense taken. I m catholic. I believe in God and that He is pure love. I also believe in Virgin Mary and Jesus. I don't consider myself a religious person but rather a spiritual one.

The points you mentioned are fair and many atheist, including my boyfriend, have say something similar to what you wrote. Just because someone does not believe in God, doesn't mean they do not have morals and ethics.

It's not right to go and tell someone that they are going to Hell for not believing. I think most of the times, Christians (I'm just using Christians as an example) feel the need to try to convert their fellow neighbors either because they really care for their well being (without realizing that they are hurting them in the process), or because they themselves fear they will end up in hell for not praising God every possible time, (they feel is their duty) or etc.

But I just hope that love will prosper.

I agree with everything said so far.

*steps down off the fence*

I have been giving this some thought today,

is there something in whether or not you believe in an afterlife.

Religious extremist groups view this life as a stepping stone to a greater after life. Hence they place no value on living.

I don't even consider myself an atheist, yet I do not have a religion. I believe there is no afterlife, I hope I am wrong.

Imagine if there was no religion? Just everybody believing in the mantra of YOLO

I believe in the after life, but not from a religious point of view, mine is from a logical point." If death is indeed final, than I have lived for naught"

There is so much truth on this single thread!

I agree with much of what has been said. I feel the power of spirituality has been largely co-opted by various organized religions. In fact, I find small religious groups to actually hold closer to the teachings of their faith-books than larger ones. I agree that ethics transcends religions.

Agnostic doubt, atheistic denial and rigid faith systems are all too categorical.

I love the profound loneliness of nature, the rapture of living in the moment and the feeling of connectedness with others at times.

I have abiding faith that man, as a successful virus, must spread to the cosmos, despite also fully recognizing the finality of entropy and the inevitable end of all.

Death is a mystery to me. At times I feel it is simply the end of my personal existence, while life carries on; at other times I wonder if something may linger or pass on. Usually I accept that these beliefs are human aspects of wishful thinking and I'm okay with that. I hope my children discover their own beliefs and act accordingly.

"Imagine if there was no religion? Just everybody believing in the mantra of YOLO"

Darren, you are lovable.

I, too, am impressed by the truth in this thread.

I guess I'm Agnostic. I usually don't believe in a God. Occasionally I believe in God. I believe in heaven when I feel like my heart will shatter if I don't. God, I hope there is a heaven.

I am very happy that this thread has been taken as intended. For me, an atheist isn't someone who says there is no god, they are someone who says that the stories of the all seeing all knowing god that some believe in, do not prove his existence and he is either man made or very sloppy in his work and not all loving and actually maniacal and capricious.

I think it is a common misconception that we have nothing to live for or are "unspiritual" and do not embrace the numinous (that with spiritual quality) in fact I think that people who do not believe in a biblical god (i'll lump in all of them with that) have more meaning in their world and value life, we actually have more to live for in fact, because if we're not going to go to heaven or hell then we will damn (no pun intended) sure make the most of this life.

Even religious people are Atheists....I mean they only believe in one god right? and not the other thousands of gods that have come before their god.......food for thought...

Take me for instance, I don't believe in a Heaven or Hell, I just don't get it. I have tried to find answers in the bible and many other religious book (I think I've read most but I find the inconsistencies too much to just ignore) but this leavers me more questions....an example, the word Alma in Hebrew is used to describe Mary.....it simply means "young woman" .....when the King James bible was translated from the Hebrew the word Alma was translated to Virgin.......do you see where I'm going with this? for me this alone brought up too many questions.....the "virgin birth" was an indication of Jesus' divinity but does this error in translation mean that he is a little less divine?

I'm just using this as an example, but my point is this; I don't find it comforting to look at something say through the hubble telescope, completely awe inspiring, and for someone to look at that and say "god made that" or for anything unknown to say that god made this, it takes all of the majesty out of it. I like the mystery of the unknown or finding out what makes something tick.

Wow I'm rambling.....I have more lol......but i'll give your eyes a rest hahaha

Well you're doing a great job questioning everything around you, and everything given for granted, since nothing can be taken for granted.

I say everyone should live by what they believe in and by what makes them happy, as long as they keep it personal.

One should put the clothes that makes them happy on, abide by their culture if they wanted or have a personal rebel over it, pray or do yoga or get drunk, things would be much easier if everyone leaves everyone doing their own business.

Sadly it's not the case.

Also, blaming a "God" would not make it easier, since those who do not believe in him cannot blame the horrific events on someone/something that doesn't exist in the 1st place.

As for those who believe, they cannot blame the doing of humans on the one whom they believe brought them to life, not even parents can prevent their kids from turning out to be evil or to do harm.

This whole earth is a mixture made of beauty and atrocity, ever since man was born, history reads parallel brutality to that of today. Postulates, perhaps.

"Even religious people are Atheists"

notice the parenthesis, Melania Trump should copy.....lol, but even atheists are religious or believers if you will....I'll leave you to understand that

Heaven is when your first child is born and you look at him and know you will never ever love anything more in life

"Well the deputy walks on hard nails and the preacher rides a mount
But nothing really matters much it's doom alone that counts
And the one-eyed undertaker he blows a futile horn
"Come in," she said,
"I'll give you shelter from the storm."

I got demoted and eventually deleted from a religious group for not conforming to the standard set by the leader who asked me to be a coordinator . The group leader latter told me that I quoted Bob too much lol
When I registered here 12 years ago it was months before I ever entered discussions . Poets tend to demand objectivity in discussion forums on most poetry sites while the exceptions are poets like Sunshine (Nana) aka Rania

^too funny, I didn't even know they ever had a religious group on this site.....question, do you think groups like that cause separation?

I got the impression the religious group was not a part of this site. I may be wrong.

You cannot quote Bob too much. Just don't let him hold you back.

"someone says, 'You're in the wrong place, my friend, you'd better leave'
And the only sound that's left after the ambulances go
Is Cinderella sweeping up on Desolation Row"

You are correct, the group is called Christian_Prophecy_Conversation at Allpoetry
The irony is the leader seems to think God hates Arabs and his most active member lives in UAE. I have little to no doubt that religion is a source of separation and religious zealots demanded God be crucified. I will have no part of a group that finds Bob Dylan distasteful lol

Hahahha omg im dying :))))

People are so messes up, i remember a christian lady at my old work place once said to me that she thought that it was amazing that Jesus spoke perfect English......i nearly shot myself.

I do enjoy reading this posts. I like the diversity and how everyone respects one another's views.